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“ QUESTION? Confusion or Meshuggah “ ?
Adj. - senseless; crazy. meshuga, meshugge, meshuggeneh, meshuggener. Yiddish - a dialect as a vernacular by many Jews; written in the Hebrew script.
This post comes out of, I guess a question From another group. The question, or ( confusion? ) was about someone denying the ( ‘verity’ ) of: “The Trinity.”
{ VERITY: a true principle or belief, especially one of fundamental importance. Truth.}
Stating -- How can JESUS be GOD? How can GOD be in heaven, while JESUS is on earth?
This to me is: Meshuggah...Craziness! It simply does not compute.
But to a young Christian ( mind ) It needs to be understood. But if your making the claim that this “un-true & un-founded” you are in denial of The True Power of GOD. This is limiting GOD. Limiting the SON. Limiting the HOLY SPIRIT. Once you begin to limit GOD, you already are denying the Power thereof. Dangerous ground from my view. Yet this question keeps emerging. This all comes out preconceived notions- ( yet another recurring theme lately ) that people have because they are NOT studying or attempting to understand what is stated by the word of GOD. Which [ IS ] TRUTH. Instead of the truth, we try to circumnavigate certain aspects, or flatly deny them, and out of that all sorts of contrivances emerge. Statements like the trinity is not in the bible...
Not in [ that ] description, no. Neither is the word bible in the bible. Yet it is edified in many different ways.
as-similes. Verb assimile first-person singular present indicative of assimiler third-person singular present indicative of assimiler first-person singular present subjunctive of assimiler third-person singular present subjunctive of assimiler second-person singular imperative of assimiler
I don't want get into a lengthy language lesson here - This is the stuff I always hated doing in English/grammar. Yet when we don't understand it we get ourselves in all sorts of trouble!
The word: ELOHIM. Elohim is a grammatically plural noun for "gods" or "deities" in Biblical Hebrew. ... However, when referring to the Hebrew GOD, ELOHIM is usually understood to be grammatically singular (i.e. it governs a singular verb or adjective).
That makes GOD a Singular PLURAL ! " One, more than One. " Which IS -- Monotheistic Pluralism. MONOTHEISM = 1 GOD. The Plurality of GOD. The earliest Aramaic-speaking Christians refer to Jesus as "Lord" in the earliest extra-canonical Christian book, the Didache, which scholars agree was written no later than the late 100s. The word "Lord" (Greek Kyrios) was used by the Greeks to designate divinity. Justin Martyr, a second-century church father, baptized new believers in the name of the triune God - Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, acknowledging the equality of the three distinct persons of the Trinity.
Polycarp of Smyrna composed an epistle to the Philippian church sometime between 110 to 140 AD, in which he indicated quite clearly that Jesus was considered to be God: Now may the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, and the eternal High-priest Himself the Son of God Jesus Christ, build you up in faith and truth, and in all gentleness and in all avoidance of wrath and in forbearance and long suffering and in patient endurance and in purity; and may He grant unto you a lot and portion among His saints, and to us with you, and to all that are under heaven, who shall believe on our Lord and God Jesus Christ and on His Father that raised him from the dead.
Ignatius Theophorus, bishop of Antioch, wrote to the Ephesian church between 107 to 110 AD: For our God, Jesus Christ, was, according to the appointment of God, conceived in the womb by Mary, of the seed of David, but by the Holy Ghost.
Justin Martyr, wrote from 155 to 160 AD: And that Christ being Lord, and God the Son of God, and appearing formerly in power as Man, and Angel, and in the glory of fire as at the bush, so also was manifested at the judgment executed on Sodom, has been demonstrated fully by what has been said. So, it is quite clear from Christian writers that Jesus was considered to be God well before the end of the second century. In other words, saying the Trinity is a new idea or concept is: M E S H U G G A H ! ! !
1 John 5:6-8 This is he that came by water and blood, [even] Jesus Christ; not by water only, but by water and blood. And it is the Spirit that beareth witness, because the Spirit is truth. For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one. And there are three that bear witness in earth, the Spirit, and the water, and the blood: and these three agree in one.
John 19:35 And he that saw it bare record, and his record is true: and he knoweth that he saith true, that ye might believe.
GOD The FATHER - GOD The SON - GOD The HOLY SPIRIT. There are Seven Spirits of GOD that we know of. Revelation 5:6 And I beheld, and, lo, in the midst of the throne and of the four beasts, and in the midst of the elders, stood a Lamb as it had been slain, having seven horns and seven eyes, which are the seven Spirits of God sent forth into all the earth.
The SEVEN SPIRITS are explained in: Isaiah 11:2 And the spirit of the LORD shall rest upon him, the spirit of wisdom and understanding, the spirit of counsel and might, the spirit of knowledge and of the fear of the LORD
1.The Spirit of The LORD 2.The Spirit of Wisdom 3.The Spirit of Understanding 4. The Spirit of Counsel 5.The Spirit of Might 6.The Spirit of Knowledge 7.The Fear of The LORD Here are [ they ] represented, The Seven Spirits, which are before the throne of GOD.
( The fear of the Lord means a sincere desire to worship GOD.) By the way… It is [ not ] a: “ spirit of fear. “ It is Love and Reverence. Respect.
( what does that have to do with this trinitarian question you ask..? )
There are many aspects of GOD we are daily, constantly trying to understand.
HE IS Complex ! And when we read something, particularly in a language that has Been derived from multiple languages, and that language is transferred or translated from one to the next, or transliterated, we tend to lose substance, context, definition, structure, and from there, we begin our rocky bumpy journey down: “ Contrivance avenue “ ! Which is right next to: “ Presupposition Place “ ( And BOTH are in a bad neighborhood ! )
Proverbs 4:7 Wisdom is the principal thing; therefore get wisdom: and with all thy getting get understanding
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Job 28:12 But where shall wisdom be found? and where is the place of understanding?
Job 28:20 Whence then cometh wisdom? and where is the place of understanding?
Proverbs 5:1 My son, attend unto my wisdom, and bow thine ear to my understanding:
*Knowing ( now ) that the word:( “ understanding “ ) in this particular instance, being one of the seven spirits of GOD - begins to emerge with more clarity when you read Proverbs 5:1 as -- My son, attend unto my wisdom, and bow thine ear to my ‘spirit’ (of) understanding !
Romans 8:15 For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.
Oh, one more thing for you “scoffers” who will attempt to insert your 2cents Concerning that the “ Trinity” is some 3rd or 4th century contrivance… KNOW and UNDERSTAND THIS: Although not as early as the Pliny letter, another secular source indicating that Jesus was worshipped as God before the fourth century was recently discovered in Megiddo, Israel. The discovery is a third century Christian church with a tile floor inlaid with inscriptions. One of the inscriptions was a tribute to Jesus, "Akeptous, the God-loving, offered this table for (the) god Jesus Christ, as a remembrance." Obviously, the discovery of a third century inscription calling Jesus God discredits the idea that Jesus was not worshipped until the fourth century.
Galatians Chapter 4:16 Am I therefore become your enemy, because I tell you the truth?
As the late Curly Howard of the famed 3 Stooges once said; “ Truth’s stranger than fiction…” !!